Beginner - recommendations for Veroboard Source?

[mkstewartesq]

Title says it. I've built around 25 pedals fromPCBs, but I'd like to start experimenting with Vero builds. Any recommendations on source/brand for decent quality vero board? I'd like to pick up something from Amazon just to start with given the ease of shipping/quick delivery but many of the reviews there note how the Vero from a given seller is, for example, is fragile, not the right material, misaligned pads lift easy, etc. So I don't know where to start for good quality boards to minimize unnecessary frustration while navigating the learning curve of this new style of building.

Thanks,
Mike

 

[readingaregood]

I honestly haven't bothered remembering a source as I've probably bought from four places and it's all been just fine. Maybe good luck on my part.

 

[BuddytheReow]

TUTORIAL - What's the Deal With Stripboard/Veroboard?

A few people have asked me about stripboard so I thought I'd do a simple writeup. Turned out a lot longer to make it "simple", but I covered the bases here. What is Stripboard? Stripboard is simply a different type of prototyping platform. If soldering is your main vice, this is the way to go...

forum.pedalpcb.com

I've been happy with Tayda ones. The big boards are less than $2 each and you can get multiple builds out of one. Sure, there are better quality ones out there, but I've had no issues with these.

Edit: You'll find that vero is much more forgiving than PCBs for soldering/desoldering.

 

[spi]

The strip boards at Tayda are fine.

If you want something more robust, then the ST2 ones are good. I found them at amazon:

Amazon.com: ST2 (Two-Pack) StripBoard, Uncut Strips, 1 Sided PCB, Size 2 = 100 x 80mm (3.94 x 3.15in) : Industrial & Scientific

 

[BuddytheReow]

Wherever you DO get them from, make sure you're getting stripboard and not generic prototyping boards. Those have no strips and you'll have to learn P2P. Just look at the pictures of them and you'll see.

 

[mkstewartesq]

Wherever you DO get them from, make sure you're getting stripboard and not generic prototyping boards. Those have no strips and you'll have to learn P2P. Just look at the pictures of them and you'll see.

Thanks to everyone for the good advice. I purchased some boards from Tayda (@BuddytheReow - I appreciate your point above, as I now can see how it would be very easy for a newbie to purchase the wrong thing) and picked out a few verified circuits to try. It will be a learning experience for sure; luckily I have built a couple of effects from PCB makers who are not as user-friendly as @Robert so I at least have a small headstart on all of the offboard wiring that I will need to figure out myself (although I am sure there will be stumbles and questions along the way).

Thanks again,
Mike

 

[Chuck D. Bones]

The strip boards at Tayda are fine.

If you want something more robust, then the ST2 ones are good. I found them at amazon:

Amazon.com: ST2 (Two-Pack) StripBoard, Uncut Strips, 1 Sided PCB, Size 2 = 100 x 80mm (3.94 x 3.15in) : Industrial & Scientific

I have used a bunch of different stripboards and the ones on Amazon are top-notch. The substrate is fiberglass which is stronger, breaks cleaner and doesn't soak up moisture like the phenolic ones. I have used the Tayda ones, they're definitely less expensive and are adequate, but not nearly as good as the ones SPI points to. With some of the other ones I've bought, the drilling was really sloppy and the holes were all over the place.

One more thing... I have seen "verified" boards on tagboardeffects that have mistakes on them. In my book, a Vero board is not verified until I have a working one in my hands.

 

[mkstewartesq]

I have used a bunch of different stripboards and the ones on Amazon are top-notch. The substrate is fiberglass which is stronger, breaks cleaner and doesn't soak up moisture like the phenolic ones. I have used the Tayda ones, they're definitely less expensive and are adequate, but not nearly as good as the ones SPI points to. With some of the other ones I've bought, the drilling was really sloppy and the holes were all over the place.

Thanks, Chuck, I had already saved the Amazon ones to my cart before throwing some in at Tayda with an order for other parts I needed. So I’ll probably go ahead and pull the trigger on the Amazon ones as well if for no other reason than for comparison purposes and, more importantly, as a better quality back up if I find that I’m having issues working with the ones from Tayda once I receive them. Since this will be my first attempt at working with this build methodology, reducing any avoidable obstacles or frustrations is really advisable for me.

Mike

 

[Chuck D. Bones]

Do you know how to cut the boards & strips?

 

[mkstewartesq]

Do you know how to cut the boards & strips?

Based on videos I have seen and articles I have read, I think so. As far as making cuts to the strips/tracks, I’m just going to use a small hand drill (manual) because I think that will be easier for me to start with and control rather than something else. As far as cutting the board, I just understood it was using a sharp blade or box cutter to score the board enough that it can then be broken. Do you have suggestions for a better method for either? (or, since I am imposing on your time, if you have some resources you would recommend that I look into myself, that would be great as well.)

Thank you,

Mike

 

[Feral Feline]

I've used both a mini-hacksaw and the scoring and breaking method — the former method generates a lot more dust, but I highly recommend
- goggles
and a
- respirator
for either method *EVEN IF you are only making a small cut/break.

I've ignored this advice myself and regretted it.

 

[Chuck D. Bones]

First thing I do is mark the board with a Sharpie where I want to break it, then I double-check it. I cut thru the holes, not between them.
To cut the board, I clamp it in a vise with the line where I want to break it just above the jaw. I use the vise as a guide for scoring both sides with a box cutter. After it's scored, I bend the board and it breaks. Next, I use a grinder to clean-up the cut edges and round the sharp corners a little.

After that, I mark where I want the strips cut and double-check it. Keep in mind that most views of a Vero board layout are from the top, but you need to mark & cut the bottom side. That means the pattern is mirrored. I used to use a 1/8" drill in a pin vise, but that took the better part of a minute to cut one spot. These days I use a drill press. I have the stop set so it drills about 1/2 thru the board. Perfect cuts and I can make 20 cuts in the time it took me to do one by hand. I should heed Feral's advice and use protection for eyes & nose.

Inspect all of the cuts under magnification because one tiny sliver of copper will turn a build session into a troubleshooting session.

Clean the copper with alcohol and you're ready to build!

I install jumpers first, then resistors. If you're socketing the ICs, then install the sockets before the resistors. I do a few at a time and check it against the layout drawing before soldering. It's too easy to install a part one hole over. There's no solder mask on most Vero boards, so be careful to avoid making solder bridges between strips. Each part installed acts as a landmark for the next few parts. When the soldering is done, inspect everything to make sure parts are installed in the right holes and there are no solder shorts between strips. When your board is done right, it looks like this. BTW, this is a fiberglass board from Amazon.

 

[mkstewartesq]

First thing I do is mark the board with a Sharpie where I want to break it, then I double-check it. I cut thru the holes, not between them.
To cut the board, I clamp it in a vise with the line where I want to break it just above the jaw. I use the vise as a guide for scoring both sides with a box cutter. After it's scored, I bend the board and it breaks. Next, I use a grinder to clean-up the cut edges and round the sharp corners a little.

After that, I mark where I want the strips cut and double-check it. Keep in mind that most views of a Vero board layout are from the top, but you need to mark & cut the bottom side. That means the pattern is mirrored. I used to use a 1/8" drill in a pin vise, but that took the better part of a minute to cut one spot. These days I use a drill press. I have the stop set so it drills about 1/2 thru the board. Perfect cuts and I can make 20 cuts in the time it took me to do one by hand. I should heed Feral's advice and use protection for eyes & nose.

Inspect all of the cuts under magnification because one tiny sliver of copper will turn a build session into a troubleshooting session.

Clean the copper with alcohol and you're ready to build!

I install jumpers first, then resistors. If you're socketing the ICs, then install the sockets before the resistors. I do a few at a time and check it against the layout drawing before soldering. It's too easy to install a part one hole over. There's no solder mask on most Vero boards, so be careful to avoid making solder bridges between strips. Each part installed acts as a landmark for the next few parts. When the soldering is done, inspect everything to make sure parts are installed in the right holes and there are no solder shorts between strips. When your board is done right, it looks like this. BTW, this is a fiberglass board from Amazon.

View attachment 51002

Thank you so much for all of this advice! Yes, I was aware that the track cuts should really be thought of as a “Mirror“ image when cutting from the back – some diagrams are helpful enough to actually include that mirror image, and for others, I plan to save the image to my iPad where I can use the photo tool to flip it. But I absolutely know 100% that at some point I’m going to put a cut in the wrong place or a component in the wrong place, but that’s all part of the learning curve. I’m already planning to have my DMM at the ready after every cut I do just to make sure that the continuity along the track has indeed been broken.

The solder bridging is definitely something I’m nervous about. I think I have pretty decent soldering technique – but that’s only based on my experience with PCBs with solder masks, which sort of do a lot of the “containment“ work for you. That’s probably the thing I’m most nervous about as far as how my first attempt will go.

Question, if you all don’t mind. Although I have both paste flux and a flux pen, I’ve never actually really needed to use them much due to the rosin core solder and the solder masks on the PCBs. When I was first watching a lot of videos to learn how to solder back in the day, I seem to remember one or two of them showing someone spreading liquid flux along a line of holes and it causing the solder to effectively “bead up” on the holes rather than flowing between them. Would that be of any help in this situation? (I will say that the few times that I have put flux on a PCB pad, it seems to have the opposite effect for me, causing the solder to wick over into solder pads that I did not mean to fill. Much desoldering braid died that day.)

Thank you again, very sincerely, for everything. I did go ahead and order the boards from Amazon for arrival this Sunday because, as noted, I want my first attempt to be on a quality board that will pose the least obstacles and then, once I’m more comfortable, I can use the Tayda boards as needed.

Mike

 

[Chuck D. Bones]

I normally don't use flux when I solder Vero boards. You can clean up solder bridges with the soldering iron or if they're tiny, an Exacto blade will do the job. This first time for anything can be a challenge, but don't worry. I've screwed up a Vero build more than once. It's always fixable. Even a wrong cut can be repaired (don't ask me how I know that).

 

[mkstewartesq]

I normally don't use flux when I solder Vero boards. You can clean up solder bridges with the soldering iron or if they're tiny, an Exacto blade will do the job. This first time for anything can be a challenge, but don't worry. I've screwed up a Vero build more than once. It's always fixable. Even a wrong cut can be repaired (don't ask me how I know that).

Thank you, Chuck, for the reassuring words. I’ve definitely got experience clearing a solder bridge with the iron and I have an Exacto knife on hand.

Best,
Mike

 

[Bricksnbeatles]

FYI: you can kill two birds with one stone by drilling all the way thru one or two of the track cuts in order to give mounting holes for nylon adhesive standoffs if there aren’t any board-mounted pots or switches (which there usually aren’t for vero builds.)

Also a 5mm brad point bit is perfect for cutting traces since the point perfectly centers in the hole while the outer cutting points score the copper cleanly so you get a clean, perfectly centered track cut without any damage to the fiberglass board.

 

[Laundryroom David]

Awesome advice and info in this thread.

Btw I doubt you’ll need extra flux. I use the same boards from Amazon and find that they take solder well. Good luck!

 

[Locrian99]

I’ve tried a couple different ones. Ive found the tayda ones are fine. I tried some higher end ones that I didn’t think worked any better were just harder to cut to size. Some
Cheaper ones that were easier but were also easier to lift the strip.

Strip board builds are cool. You feel like you are really diying it. After doing a couple larger ones I really limit how big of one I will do. Spending hours making the board (cutting it, jumpers, cuts) and then moving on to adding components for something I could have just bought a board for and had done in an hour tops got old. That being said I still make one occasionally. If I was to have any advice it would be to double check everything as you go. And make a sharpie grid on your board and layout. Take your time adding components. Double check you are putting it in the right spot. It’s so easy to make a mistake and so hard to find later.

As Chuck mentioned watch out for verified boards wirb mistakes. Sea machine in dirtboxlayouts is one that comes to mind, it works as it’s there but one of the pots does nothing.