Cloven Hoof

[Diatrive]

Hello all,

I am building a Cloven Hoof and want to make some things sure.

1: Does the new LED alignment apply to the clipping LEDs also. i.e. The short wire goes in the square?
2: Do the 1N4148 diodes have the side with the ring going into the square pad?

Thanks!

 

[Chuck D. Bones]

If you want your build to exactly match the schematic, then the square pad is the anode of the diodes. The ring on the 1N4148 is the cathode, that goes to the round pad. The short lead on the LED is the cathode, that goes to the round pad. Technically, you can do it either way on this board because the diodes are wired back-to-back.

 

[Diatrive]

Thanks man!
In general with clipping LED's the short cathode goes in the round pad? On the on/off LED the short cathode goes in the square?

 

[Chuck D. Bones]

There general rule here regarding LEDs is to read this post. The Ungula board design is old and does not follow the industry standard. The indicator LED is also "backwards" on this board. When in doubt, check the board against the schematic, either following the traces visually or with a continuity meter (DVM). Or ask here. There is always someone ready to help.

 

[Diatrive]

Ahh ok. Mine is the new style. I understand it for the on/off LED I just wasn't sure if the info in the link applied to the clipping LED as well.
I just really want to understand it as I don't want to have to pull out the solder sucker again.

 

[Chuck D. Bones]

The board pic in the v2 build doc still shows the "bellend" LED pattern. If your board does not look like that, then it's been updated and the build docs need to catch up. Like I said before, with D1-D4 it doesn't matter as long D1 faces the opposide way as D2, D3 is opposite D4. For the ON/OFF LED, the pad that connects to the + pad is the anode (long lead).

 

[Diatrive]

Thanks, it's working. Sounds good, the LED's inside are lighting when there is signal.
I do have an issue though. It is QUIET, the quietest pedal I have built out of 20. To reach the volume of my hoof at 9 o'clock I have to have the Cloven at 3 o'clock. Anything that would generally cause the drop in volume?

Thanks!

 

[Chuck D. Bones]

Changing D1 & D2 from LEDs (Hoof) tos 1N4148s (Cloven) will lower the volume by 9dB or so. That by itself does not explain the huge difference in volume. If one of the the resistors in the last 2 stages was the wrong value, that could explain the volume drop. Verify those visually or measure the collector voltage on Q3 & Q4. Does the TONE control work as expected? What do you have connected after the Cloven Hoof? The LEVEL pot is A1M, which to me makes no sense because unless it is set below 5 or above 9, the next pedal in the chain could load it down considerably. For that reason, I use A100K in my Hoof.

 

[Diatrive]

I just checked all the components and all are correct.
The elec capacitor is oriented correctly.
Tone control works great.
I don't have any pedals on either side. Just guitar cable into pedal into amp.
I am not the best at checking voltages.
No power:
Q2 and Q3 - C: .5 D+E: 0
D1 and D2 - 2.2 / 2.2
Power:
Q2 - C: 6 D: 1 E: 1
Q3 - C: 6 D: 1 E: 16.5
D1 and D2 - 1.04 / .87

I unfortunately don't know what any of this means. The only thing that jumps out at me is the 16.5 on Q3 when under power.

Thanks for all your help!

 

[Chuck D. Bones]

Are you measuring voltage or resistance? Some of those readings make no sense to me. Connect the black meter lead to ground. Power the pedal up. With the red meter lead, measure voltage on the collector of each transistor, one at a time. If you're looking at the flat face of the transistor, the emitter is on the left, base in the middle, collector is on the right. No need to measure anything with power off.

 

[Diatrive]

DC Voltage. The black is clipped to the ground on the IN jack. I tested everything twice. Thanks again : )

Q1 C- 3.84
D- .623
E- 34.9
Q2 C- 6.09
D- 1.068
E- 19.5
Q3 C- 6.01
D- 1.052
E- 16.3
Q4 C- 3.74
D- 1.788
E- 1.206

 

[Chuck D. Bones]

I think I have your measurements figured out. 34.9 is 34.9 mV. You are typing "D", but you mean "B" for base. Everything looks right. Because Q2 & Q3 are Darlingtons and the bias resistors are sized for regular Si transistors, the bias on those two runs a little cold. That's expected and nothing to worry about. Q4 is biased pretty hot and the result is reduced headroom, but not enough to cause the low volume. Are you sure that the LEVEL pot on both pedals is A1M? It's easy to check with an ohmmeter without opening the pedal. Here's how: get a patch cable & a spare 1/4" jack. Unplug power from the pedal. Plug the patch cable between the pedal's output and the 1/4" jack. Measure the resistance from tip to ring on the jack with the LEVEL at minimum, noon and maximum. Minimum should be close to zero, noon should be around 150K and max should be around 1Meg. Pots have loose tolerance so +/- 20% is OK.

 

[Diatrive]

Whoa! That is a great tip. I will definitely remember that one.
Both the Hoof and the Cloven Hoof have pretty much the same values /shrug
I checked the values on the components again also. This is a strange one.

 

[Chuck D. Bones]

If the components are all correct, then the volume difference has to be caused by LEDs (Hoof) vs. Si diodes (Cloven) in the last stage.

 

[gri]

im in the same boat as Diatrive. its boggling. me. i did cloven mod. even took out diodes in d1/d2 went LED. no real change. i socketed. sounds sputtery and super low volume. like its being choked