UtilityBeltFX
Well-known member
I appreciate the thorough write up! You really know your stuff!
Wah Inductors. No hype. Just measurements.
- Thread starter Stickman393
- Start date
Stickman393
Well-known member
Remember, peak of mount stupid. To prove it: did you know that there was a crybaby that pre-dated the vox grey wah?
It just so happens that it's true! The vox grey wah was invented when the guitar player inventer, Roman Ed Paul, got tired of gently nudging his newborn with his foot to get that "wahhhh" sound. Plus, the kid was starting to sprout teeth and the penicillin injections after every gig were getting expensive. So he conjured the Vox Grey into existence by claiming that all other guitars aside from his were crap.
Deep cuts right there. I've been online for too much of my life.
Honestly, I'm looking through old photos. I wouldn't be surprised if he had multiple crybabies over the years. Could be he started out with one from the 80s, and went through a few.
Feral Feline
Well-known member
Might have been cheaper to just keep knocking up another kid... endless supply of "wahhhh" — then again, the patrimony suits and lawyer fees for custody battles (letting the other side win once the kid is past its wahhhh-prime)...
Stickman393
Well-known member
Necessity is the mother of destruction. A penny saved is a penny kept out of the poor's grubby hands.
...DAMMIT, STICKMAN, STOP DERAILING YOUR OWN THREAD!
...DAMMIT, STICKMAN, STOP DERAILING YOUR OWN THREAD!
Wonder if any of these Dales would have some promise.
Stickman393
Well-known member
Took a quick look:
That's a negative. Nothing in the right range of 500-650mh. DCR values too high in the hundreds of millihenries.
Truthfully: If one wants to go on the cheaper side of things...I really like the Stompbox parts ME-6. Its a fantastic wah inductor for...like...stupid cheap.
I'd throw one of those in a pedal over a modern Red Fasel any day of the week.
That's a negative. Nothing in the right range of 500-650mh. DCR values too high in the hundreds of millihenries.
Truthfully: If one wants to go on the cheaper side of things...I really like the Stompbox parts ME-6. Its a fantastic wah inductor for...like...stupid cheap.
I'd throw one of those in a pedal over a modern Red Fasel any day of the week.
Stickman393
Well-known member
A'ite folks, I've conquered the el rad.
No destruction this time around. In truth, it kinda looks like a lower value red fasel. Sorta. Higher DCR though.
Honestly, I've found the toroids that I've measured to vary the most. Could be minor variations in the ways that the wire is wrapped...being non-delicious donuts, rather than simple spools, it's a much more difficult prospect in trying to wind them consistently.
There are designs online for toroid winding machines, but they are generally designed to wind toroids in the 75-150mm diameter range. Too big. making a loop that would work for something this size would be difficult.
Colorsound documented too.
I'm also doing some revisions to my excel document. I'm now going to be taking every single measurement I can grab from my little LCR meter so I can have a more complete dataset moving forward.
Eventually I want to get all this stuff set up in such a way that one can select different attributes and generate comparative graphs and such. Cause that would be fun.
No destruction this time around. In truth, it kinda looks like a lower value red fasel. Sorta. Higher DCR though.
Honestly, I've found the toroids that I've measured to vary the most. Could be minor variations in the ways that the wire is wrapped...being non-delicious donuts, rather than simple spools, it's a much more difficult prospect in trying to wind them consistently.
There are designs online for toroid winding machines, but they are generally designed to wind toroids in the 75-150mm diameter range. Too big. making a loop that would work for something this size would be difficult.
Colorsound documented too.
I'm also doing some revisions to my excel document. I'm now going to be taking every single measurement I can grab from my little LCR meter so I can have a more complete dataset moving forward.
Eventually I want to get all this stuff set up in such a way that one can select different attributes and generate comparative graphs and such. Cause that would be fun.
Stickman393
Well-known member
I gotta print that shit out. Trying to read it on my phone makes me go cross-eyed.
Same
Stickman393
Well-known member
A'ite folks: I've added a few more recently
Of particular note are two additional fasels from two JEN mister crybaby supers that I was able to snag on the cheap recently.
One red, one white. I've seen a bunch of colors online...green fasels exist somewhere. Orange fasels were available briefly with the first generation Dunlop Mister Crybaby Super...which I *believe* was released in the early 90s. Dunno for certain though. What's the difference? Did those orange fasels come from an existing stock that Dunlop acquired when they bought the crybaby name? Dunno.
I also recently picked up the fancy all-chrome monstrosity that is the late model Budda Bud-Wah. Budda was bought by Peavey and ground into a paste back in 2009: the redesign of the Bud-Wah followed that acquisition.
They had their wahs manufactured by Dunlop up until that point. I've read that the reason you can find some N30 1408 ferrites in some of their pedals is because those were left over from winding inductors for Budda...but TBH I'm not convinced of that. For one thing: the N30 inductor I have from Dunlop dates to 1993 where as Budda wasn't incorporated until 1995, and if Dunlop wound these for Budda then they certainly didn't learn a damned thing from that experience, cause the Dunlop N30 1408 measures like any of their other coils from that time period dropped into a higher Al ferrite. DCR similar to the others from that time period.
Its possible. The folks behind Budda could have been doing some R&D work behind the scenes. *Supposedly* the N30 is rumored to be similar to what was used in the fasels, but I couldn't tell ya for certain. Just bullshit I've read online.
BUT! Thats all just to kinda beat around what I wanted to cover: a photo of the old vs the redesigned PCB, AND a realization that I had when I was measuring the latest Budda inductor:
Im pretty sure those guys used a 1408p for theirs. But I'll be goddamned if they didn't use a 5/8" copper plumbing cap to house the thing.
Kinda genius, really. Much cheaper than purpose-built inductor housings, plus it provides a solid shield around the inductor.
Behold!
Of particular note are two additional fasels from two JEN mister crybaby supers that I was able to snag on the cheap recently.
One red, one white. I've seen a bunch of colors online...green fasels exist somewhere. Orange fasels were available briefly with the first generation Dunlop Mister Crybaby Super...which I *believe* was released in the early 90s. Dunno for certain though. What's the difference? Did those orange fasels come from an existing stock that Dunlop acquired when they bought the crybaby name? Dunno.
I also recently picked up the fancy all-chrome monstrosity that is the late model Budda Bud-Wah. Budda was bought by Peavey and ground into a paste back in 2009: the redesign of the Bud-Wah followed that acquisition.
They had their wahs manufactured by Dunlop up until that point. I've read that the reason you can find some N30 1408 ferrites in some of their pedals is because those were left over from winding inductors for Budda...but TBH I'm not convinced of that. For one thing: the N30 inductor I have from Dunlop dates to 1993 where as Budda wasn't incorporated until 1995, and if Dunlop wound these for Budda then they certainly didn't learn a damned thing from that experience, cause the Dunlop N30 1408 measures like any of their other coils from that time period dropped into a higher Al ferrite. DCR similar to the others from that time period.
Its possible. The folks behind Budda could have been doing some R&D work behind the scenes. *Supposedly* the N30 is rumored to be similar to what was used in the fasels, but I couldn't tell ya for certain. Just bullshit I've read online.
BUT! Thats all just to kinda beat around what I wanted to cover: a photo of the old vs the redesigned PCB, AND a realization that I had when I was measuring the latest Budda inductor:
Im pretty sure those guys used a 1408p for theirs. But I'll be goddamned if they didn't use a 5/8" copper plumbing cap to house the thing.
Kinda genius, really. Much cheaper than purpose-built inductor housings, plus it provides a solid shield around the inductor.
Behold!
Feral Feline
Well-known member
Man, the deeper you dive, the more interesting this thread gets and the more dangerous it becomes — I might have to experiment with more Wahs than I can afford or even know Wah't-a-do-with...
Nonetheless, I wahl continue my Remora-ride on the StickShark as it devours all Wah in the path of its descent.
Nonetheless, I wahl continue my Remora-ride on the StickShark as it devours all Wah in the path of its descent.
Stickman393
Well-known member
You've got a Stalo on the way. Like. Soonish. I keep on getting distracted. My bad. Its already made, just gotta like...find time to actually do the work of putting together doomy's package with yours and figuring out how to do international mail. As if it was hard.
I procrastinate. I get distracted. Mailing things is unnaturally stress-inducing for me. Don't judge me. I'm eccentric, goddammit!!!
Yessssssss. Do this. Doooooo thisssssssss.