Let's talk end-of-chain volume circuits...

[The Gator]

Ever have a drive or fuzz pedal that you absolutely love the sound of completely cranked (aka dimed) but it is just so hot your pushing your preamp way too hard in your favorite amp?
I have this disease. I want to look at end of chain volume circuits...or a simple add on circuit that goes at the end of a circuit right before the wire heading to the out jack.
Am I nuts for even messing with this?

What got me thinking about this is the two sticks of derm circuit. It sounds amazing cranked all the way. But that sucker is so bloody loud its insane.
I was thinkin about a 100k to 500k trimmer with pin one coming from the circuit, pin two to the output jack,and pin three to ground. It could be dialed down to top out whete you want.
I would love to hear some opinions and advice.
As always, thank you very much.
~Gator

 

[jwin615]

Like this?

 

[The Gator]

...I knew someone was going to do that...

I guess I'm just gonna make an overall volume range control so as not to change the existing single knob design but make it's range more usable.
If I change the original pot, it changes the tone.
I guess I should explain my design of the circuit further.
I will post a build for anyone interested.

~Gator

 

[jwin615]

Could try tweaking that output cap value, or just jumpering it. Then it's not in play with the toan. What the volume(or any other pot) will still be mojoing with is any following impedance from inputs or cables. I don't think another trimmer will help with that. A end of chain buffer would though, and you could pad it down as needed there.

 

[MichaelW]

Ever have a drive or fuzz pedal that you absolutely love the sound of completely cranked (aka dimed) but it is just so hot your pushing your preamp way too hard in your favorite amp?
I have this disease. I want to look at end of chain volume circuits...or a simple add on circuit that goes at the end of a circuit right before the wire heading to the out jack.
Am I nuts for even messing with this?

What got me thinking about this is the two sticks of derm circuit. It sounds amazing cranked all the way. But that sucker is so bloody loud its insane.
I was thinkin about a 100k to 500k trimmer with pin one coming from the circuit, pin two to the output jack,and pin three to ground. It could be dialed down to top out whete you want.
I would love to hear some opinions and advice.
As always, thank you very much.
~Gator

How about just putting a clean boost at the end of your chain to "throttle" back the overall gain of the signal?

 

[Coda]

How about just putting a clean boost at the end of your chain to "throttle" back the overall gain of the signal?

Or an EQ pedal…

 

[spi]

Another option is this pedal. I believe it was meant to bring the volume down, but with some eq to adjust how it impacts the signal.

Cold Turkey EQ - PedalPCB.com

 

[jhaneyzz]

I have an EQ pedal last in my chain that I use for this, and any other toan shaping.

 

[The Gator]

The two sticks of derm is so much louder it is not easily used in a live situation.
That is why I want an internal overall volume control at the very end of the circuit.
Anybody else here build that circuit? Is your extremely loud?

 

[jwin615]

C8 and R9 form a 31hz low cut. Otherwise, the 1 pot is at the end of the circuit.
Any tone change perceived by the volume pot isn't the pot interacting with the circuit.
Perceived tone change could be:
-The pot interacting with the impedance of cable at the output and/or next device input.
-The added output altering the tone of the next device by clipping it, with less clipping as you turn it down.
-Fletcher and Munson doing their thing from the grave.
See: Fletcher Munson equal loudness curve. Perceived tone changes depending on volume.
-a combination of all of these.

Put any decent buffer after it and turn it down. That's as good as it will get. Or, build a buffer in the box
Could even use an internal trimmer so no alterations are needed to the enclosure.

 

[The Gator]

Good point.
Thank you you to all for the assistance and ideas.
I think I should change the title of this thread and the direction of it.
I think what I really want to do is add an internal master volume to make the range of the external pot more usable. My version of the pedal is a bit of a novelty.
I think I eally just want most of the single knobs range to be usable.

 

[cdwillis]

What about pulling leg 3 off the volume pot off the pad and jumpering between them with a 47k resistor? That should cut the volume down about half as loud.

 

[manfesto]

Or the good ol' "replace the linear taper pot with an audio taper pot", should better distribute the volume around the dial

 

[jwin615]

Could increase R8 to alter the gain of the final stage. Maybe try a 10k-15k trimmer and tune if from there?

 

[The Gator]

Yes I did some testing last night with a breadboard of the circuit adding 100k trimmer in between volune pot leg 3 and the rest of the circuit. The max db of the circuit was reduced considerably.
This is probably close to what I will end up doing as it seems to get what I want better. Once I find the value of resistance that gets the desired reduction in max db, I will put a resistor inline there.
I am going to do more testing tonight.

As a fun novelty to the build, I am using a 50k double pot . The second pot goes in series with a warm white led in the jewel. As the giant knob is turned up, the volume gets louder and the light gets brighter...
I know, cheesy, but it is fun.
I am going to do a demo build report as soon as I iron out this last bit.

 

[mdc]

You should really just try swapping the B-taper volume for an A-taper.

 

[The Gator]

I get what you are saying but that will not be enough for this build. Not for my goal. This circuit is about 10 times louder than unity when turned all the way up.
I am sure it is hard to understand now, but when I get back home I will do a demo build thread so you can see.

 

[melveyr]

i can second the cold turkey EQ. its a great signal attenuator

 

[jesuscrisp]

Guys saying get a boost/EQ pedal you do realize that the Fuzz will also slam the everliving crap out of that pedal without signal attenuation before the input of the EQ/boost unless you're running something with incredible headroom?

@OP I get that you found a solution but your thinking isn't very "scientifc". My guess is the simplest solution would have been to change the volume knob taper to log and snip out the filtering (even just the 51K resistor to ground). That way there shouldn't be any more interaction between the pedal's tone and volume.

 

[The Gator]

Yeah I get what your saying. Do that and turn it down.
I realized earlier I named the thread wrong and really I am looking to reduce the overall volume. I plan on changing the taper as well. I just don't expect that to do enough for what I want.
I when I get back I will try your suggestion with the 51k to ground.
Thank you for everyone's input!

~Gator