PedalPCB 5-Loop True Bypass Switcher

[bluedmc777]

I think the easiest method would probably be the ability to switch between groups with dip switches ala Carl Martin but also, if possible, have a toggle switch that allows you to switch to live mode where you’re allowed turn any one, two however many pedals on like it’s a standard bypass strip.

Buffered at front or end preferably. What I’ve always imagined but I’m not smart enough is how one could something like this a module. Where you could buy 3 or however many banks at a time and add as you go.

 

[benny_profane]

Switchboard™ Effects Operator | Effects Pedals

Fender Switchboard Effects Operator

www.fender.com

 

[Robert]

I was just looking at that.

 

[benny_profane]

I was just looking at that.

Looks pretty great.

 

[giovanni]

Switchboard™ Effects Operator | Effects Pedals

Fender Switchboard Effects Operator

www.fender.com

That’s a pretty reasonable price for what it is. I mean the Boss one is cheaper but I don’t think you can skip the buffers (I’m not sure about that actually). If this is closer to GigRig it’s a good deal.

 

[jimilee]

It begs the question though: Do we really need something like this?

I’m NEVER going to play on stage where I’d need this. It certainly would not stop me from getting one, because I think preset capable switching is fucking awesome, but I’d surely have no practical use for it. And the cabling and connectors alone would probably cost close to $200.

Super fucking cool.

Not at all practical. And that’s fine too.

Truth. I built one from BYOC. It looks sharp just sitting there not being used. I can’t wait for this one.

 

[Robert]

I want to see how they're handling the effects order switching...

I drew up a relay matrix a while back that could do it, but it involved a lot of relays.

I suppose you could combine solid state routing along with mechanical relays to swap order while maintaining true-bypass without 50 relays...

 

[jimilee]

Sh

I want to see how they're handling the effects order switching...

I drew up a relay matrix a while back that could do it, but it involved a lot of relays.

I suppose you could combine solid state routing along with mechanical relays to swap order while maintaining true-bypass without 50 relays...

Sheeeeit, how big is this switcher??

 

[giovanni]

It begs the question though: Do we really need something like this?

I’m NEVER going to play on stage where I’d need this. It certainly would not stop me from getting one, because I think preset capable switching is fucking awesome, but I’d surely have no practical use for it. And the cabling and connectors alone would probably cost close to $200.

Super fucking cool.

Not at all practical. And that’s fine too.

Yeah that’s fair. And the main reason why I never considered one. I think it’s useful for working musicians, especially for cover bands with a large repertoire. There was this cover band when I lived in PA called Velveeta and I think the guitarist could have used something like this!

 

[benny_profane]

I want to see how they're handling the effects order switching...

I drew up a relay matrix a while back that could do it, but it involved a lot of relays.

I suppose you could combine solid state routing along with mechanical relays to swap order while maintaining true-bypass without 50 relays...

The boss one adds the parallel option too.

 

[Giorfida]

wonder if it could be sandwiched into steel building studs? Could be some cheap enclosures of just the right shape

 

[mdc]

Tails, please.

 

[juice886]

If you end up with a non-programmable switcher it would be really good to have 2 different switching modes:
"and" - like a normal bypass when you can have multiple loops engaged at a time
"or"- only one loop can be engaged at a time, so when you engage some loop all other loops will be disengaged.

Extending my previous comment. I think such kind of a non-programmable switcher would be great to have in a smaller form-factor. It can be really handy in cases when someone wants to combine 2 or 3 different effects in one enclosure.
So if I want to put 3 different effects in 1590DD (or 2 effects in 1590BB) then all the switching will be done with a separate PCB that has two switching algorithms and optional 'high studio quality audio grade' input and output buffers in addition. I'd buy for sure

 

[Alan W]

I'm not opposed to multiple projects, in fact I'm planning on it.

I do want to do some Arduino projects as well, so it's certainly not out of the question.

Working up a design now for a fully passive 3PDT based version.

Not that I’m opposed to building several varieties of switchers (or anything else, it would seem), but knowing what some of the other upcoming options might be would certainly be great. I know it’s still early in the process, and your starting this thread as an organizing one for the possible line of switchers is great.

 

[Alan W]

I’ve built a few “dumb” loop switchers, and used 1x 2 inch aluminum tubing as a housing. I cut one of the 2 inch sides so that only 1/4 inch is left on each side, and screw in a thin plate of aluminum on the bottom, with folds at each end to close it up. (There is a slight notch cut into the 1/4 inch returns on the bottom, so that the bottom plate can fold in flush.)

Besides very low cost (especially if you have a stock of aluminum, which I used to), its pretty unlimited as to how many loops you can fit in, with as much space between the buttons as you want.

 

[CR0SSBL4DE]

I want to see how they're handling the effects order switching...

I drew up a relay matrix a while back that could do it, but it involved a lot of relays.

I suppose you could combine solid state routing along with mechanical relays to swap order while maintaining true-bypass without 50 relays...

My calculations are that for 100% mechanical routing and switching one would need:

[X = No. of loops]
No. of SPDT relays = 2 * X * (X-1) + X

1 loop --> 2 relays
2 loop --> 6 relays
3 loop --> 15 relays
4 loop --> 28 relays
5 loop --> 45 relays

I doubt that's what they are doing on the fender switcher. I wonder if jumping all the loops and measuring with input/output with a DMM would give you continuity. That's what I would assume for "true by pass switching". (also it has a volume control integrated)

 

[Robert]

My calculations are that for 100% mechanical routing and switching one would need:

I'm wondering if they're using a combination of mechanical and solid state switching...

Relays to bypass, but solid state switching to route the order when a loop is active. That'd still technically be true bypass ...

I might have to crack one open just to see...

 

[giovanni]

I think there must be a way to reduce the number of relays needed. I did a smidge of research and what we are looking at here is a permutation graph. I think the key is that whenever you want to change the order of a loop, that implies that all other loops change their relative order. For example if you have pedals in order A,B,C,D and want to move A between C and D, the relative order of B and C also changes, going from 2nd and 3rd to 1st and 2nd respectively. I feel like this property could be used to come up with some clever switching architecture but I haven’t had a aha moment to figure that out.

 

[Robert]

I'm mostly just curious how it works. I'm not really planning to do order switching in this project right now.

Without a true display like the Fender unit has I can't imagine setting that sort of thing up would be much fun. I know the GigRig does it, but that's just too much stomping and clicking for my tastes.

"Hold this switch now tap that one three times, loop A and B have now swapped order unless you were holding down C at the same time. If so, now D is A and B is C and E... well I don't really know where E went ..."

 

[giovanni]

Now I’m down a rabbit hole of permutation network switching and whatnot. Somebody stop me!